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Who told you that? A file will cut it fine.If it's properly hardened a file will not cut it.
Who told you that? A file will cut it fine.If it's properly hardened a file will not cut it.
Originally Posted by Err
Sorry. I guess I should stick to pushing pencils instead of dispensing advice about subjects I have absolutely no knowledge of. Thanks for setting me straight....
A good test of hardening is that a file will skate rather than cut.
You will need a carbide or diamond file to work hardened steel, and it will be sisyphean as alchemist has put it.
I believe I can disagree without taking offence, see if you can reciprocate.
I think you should be slow to discourage people from tackling such projects, if others had discouraged me I might never have made my first knife.
A pic would be helpful.
You COULD use a bastard file - but I wouldn't. Somehow the idea of using a bastard on a Nenox wouldn't be a first choice especially if it was stuck in a vice. If you had to you could do it that way, but again not my first choice. I'd prefer a LOW speed belt sander. You certainly can reshape a knife with it without annealing the knife IF you don't ruin the heat treating. If the knife never gets any hotter than it would if you washed it with hot water, it won't affect the heat treatment. Now if you do use a higher speed belt grinder, there is an excellent chance you will ruin the temper - particularly on the tip unless you are skilled enough to control it very well. I wouldn't learn this on a Nenox.
BTW, Alchemist, you have some very interesting natural stones on your web site. A discussion of those would make for a most interesting post. Sorry to go off topic, but I couldn't help but notice.
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Ken
http://www.preciseknifesharpening.blogspot.com
"When you can measure what you are speaking about, and express it in numbers, you know something about it; but when you cannot measure it, when you cannot express it in numbers, your knowledge is of a meagre and unsatisfactory kind; it may be the beginning of knowledge, but you have scarcely in your thoughts advanced to the state of Science, whatever the matter may be."
Baron William Thomson Kelvin 1883
I'll say it again:, a file will cut it just fine. If the bastard doesn't work, try a diamond hone or a carbide.
If you have the $$, get a belt sander; but if you think this might be your only knife-shaping project you could save some $$ by using hand tools.
Without a pic, based just on what I've read here- my guess, I think all you need is a new edge, maybe some thinning, and probably a new handle to restore it to a serviceable knife. For what you might spend on tools, you could get a new one in the shape you prefer and keep the one in question more or less as it was designed.
No doubt you can, but can you do the same with out causing offense?
I was not discouraging anyone. I think anybody who decides to do something with their hands is immediately blessed - no matter how the project ends up! But whether you agree with it or not, the fact remains: post heat treat grinding WILL create new tensions in the steel (water cooling or not) and the outcome will, in most cases be, not as favorable as it can be (unless you relax the steel again - and this works only in SOME cases on some steels). I say this from the stand point and experience of a tool maker who has been making blades all day, every day for a VERY long time. If I sound pretty sure of myself - it's because I am. What are you basing your experience on?
I made two knives so far, I have 4 more off for heat treat. All stock removal. I suppose that means I lose this pissing contest, does it? You make some pretty nice knives btw.
More importantly, and as I already said, I took my first finished knife, reshaped and thinned it and refinished it after hardening which is pretty much exactly what the OP wants to do or have done to his knife.
I wonder How Bark River manage to make thousands of knives grinding them post HT and how I managed to rework mine. Easy, you keep them cool by dipping in water. Your tensions (stresses) in the steel argument is irrelevant and somewhat specious because they'd only be a problem if you were going to reheat, that is they could cause a failure during the quench.
Many other makers grind entirely after HT. I prefer to take them down to rough profile before HT and finish them after, but I'm still taking material off the hardened steel with a belt grinder.
IF you go from the forged blade to finished knife without the use of powertools then more power to your elbow. Many others don't and make excellent knives. Who knows what damage they are doing to the soul of the steel of course
Mike Stewart BRKT http://www.knifeforums.com/forums/sh...hp?tid/870201/We grind after heat treat so we are always grinding hardened steel.
We keep it cool by dipping the blade in water buckets that we have next to each grinder.
I'm not sure what I have said to you that has caused offense, maybe you can point it out?
Alchemist,
Something is missing here. Obviously, if you sharpen an edge with a 10k grit waterstone, you aren't suggesting that you need to redo the heat treatment, right? How about a 120 grit? Now if I am grinding moving at say a belt speed of 1 foot per second, this seems slow enough to not cause any thermal issues. So at what speed or at what heat level do you feel that the original tempering is affected?
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Ken
http://www.preciseknifesharpening.blogspot.com
"When you can measure what you are speaking about, and express it in numbers, you know something about it; but when you cannot measure it, when you cannot express it in numbers, your knowledge is of a meagre and unsatisfactory kind; it may be the beginning of knowledge, but you have scarcely in your thoughts advanced to the state of Science, whatever the matter may be."
Baron William Thomson Kelvin 1883
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